Where There's Will, There's a Way

The thread is for discussion of the article Where There's Will, There's a Way

I like how my deck has 1 Scrubland and 0 white cards, and 1 red card and 0 red lands.

Well, the good thing is that considering the relatively small pool of Classic players, and the fact you'll only need 1, there should be plenty of Will's initially.

And we're getting Urza's which will dump a bunch into circulation too.

I would get the Oath Cal. Reason being, LED will eventually get restricted, Mox D is meh, Null Rods become better with MED4.

I don't imagine will being that much ... after the initial dust settles, the amount of people (us) Who would want a will should be less that the amount who have then.. Then Saga will just create more.

Originally posted by PhilipJFry Is there any way to know ahead of time how many Yawg Wills are going to enter the system mid Feb? Here's to hoping they aren't priced through the roof.

Well as of Jan 27, there were 271 people already qualified for Season 1 (15 points) and 545 total with 10 or more points going down the stretch.  It's probably safe to say at least half of the people who have 10-14 points will make it, which brings the theoretical total to 408, and then there is the last chance qualifiers.  So lets' shortchange some folk and say it's 450, though it would easily be as many as 600.

To get an idea of how many 450 Yawgmoth's Will is, in order for EEE drafts to have pumped out that many Oath of Druids (another card only good in Vintage) over it's 2 week release period, it would have had to fire 825 drafts, or just over 58 drafts a day minus the small number of Foil Oaths that appeared.  This is almost exactly how many EEE drafts there were, and at the end of that, the price was close to 45

Now, factor in the fact that YawgWin is already restricted, and so the demand is now cut in quarter, so say about 11.  Then add in the demand that YawgWin fits into more than one deck, and I think you are looking at 25.  Then subtract the fact that YawgWin is going to be released in Saga not 6 weeks later, and i think you are looking at a $15 card.  If something like 600 people qualify, you are looking at about a $10 card.

Yup.  I really think that way.

PS - the foil one will be worth insane amounts - there are only 32 to start - I won't bother to guess.


Edited by dangerlinto - 02 Feb 2010 at 12:21pm

Originally posted by SICKSICKSICK @danger: Do you have a proposed decklist with YW and 4x Mystical Tutor?

Kind of a loaded question - but what would I do right now?

Take the list that's in the article,

+1 Burning Wish (MD)
-1 Necropotence (MD)

-2 Sadistic Sacrament (SB)
-1 Slaughter Pact (SB)
+2 Mystical Tutor (SB)
+1 Tendrils of Agony (SB)

I have never liked Necro in ANT.  It's there to do something when you can't get Ad Naus runing either becuase it's been extirpated, gaddocked or meddled.  YawgWin settles mot of the problems that Necro tries to solve only you don't have to wait until next turn and leave your hand open to removal, and give the opponent another turn to find an answer

The only reason I wouldn't MD another 2 Mysticals is the deck is pretty tight with Infernals and LED - I'd board them in when facing down a lot of discard.  However, if LED gets a restriction, there goes about 6 cards from the deck (Infernal is no longer worth playing) and you'd definitely switch straight to 4x Mystical tutor MD.

Edit: I'd also like to find a way to squeeze SDT in there since for 1 mana it turns all those Mysticals and Vampiric tutor into demonic tutors for the price of - very handy post-AdN and none too sabby pre-AdN either.





Edited by dangerlinto - 02 Feb 2010 at 12:51pm

I only had 8 points when the QPs last went out but I got to 19 around 3am Sunday night.

Originally posted by Darter101 I don't imagine will being that much ... after the initial dust settles, the amount of people (us) Who would want a will should be less that the amount who have then.. Then Saga will just create more. I'm still trying to convince my fiance' that a set of force of wills on here is easily woth 200 bucks that we could otherwise save towards our wedding.....its only about one guest to un-invite anyway, I can think of a ton of her family who could be un-invited.....Just saying...

That kind of logic may get YOU uninvited.

Don't mess with a woman's wedding plans; just agree to cede control to her and you're halfway 100% of the way to a blissful maa-widge.

Unban Will - in Legacy?

Desire gets to play good cards like Gush and FOW that Nauseam doesn't.

Will might make Desire good enough.

This may be slightly off topic, but since we get Urza's in 60 days, is anyone else excited as to what else we get to use and what builds become viable ?

Originally posted by Juan007 I really, really hope that Mystical and LED aren't restricted prematurely. Building an entire deck around resolving Yawgmoth's Will is a strategy that is so easily hated out. How about Island + Extract? Silence / Chant? Meddling Mage? Ravenous Trap? Tormod's? I can go on all day, but there are giant 0 cc and 1 cc speed bumps that every color has access to.

First - did you even read the article?  It's precisely the point you do not build solely around Will.

 Vintage has access to all those speed bumps as well, and yet the very same cards are restricted for the very same reasons.  Those cards are an even GREATER speed bump in vintage.

Saying "Oh there is a strategy you can board in to beat it" is one of the most terrible analysis of a card or deck's impact on the meta game.  There is a strategy to beat every deck - if there wasn't evryone would play that deck.

Originally posted by Juan007 The standard for restricting cards shouldn't be "you can build a good deck with this card as a 4x", it should be "there is no way to stop this strategy with this card as a 4x".

That is not at all how cards are restricted or banned.  Cards are restricted or banned because they have an unheathy effect on the meta game.   For example, do you think Oath of Druids would be absolutely unstoppable in Legacy?    Or that even though people have access to umpteen million ways to hose the graveyard, destroy enchantments and remove creatures from the game at an instant, that Worldgorger Dragon would be unstoppable?

You miss entirely why cards are B&R.  It's to shape a healthy meta with the expectations that the participants have.  Flash wasn't unstoppable.  Necropotoence wasn't unstopabble. Tinker and Balance aren't unstoppable.  They merely represent the types of cards that you do not want repetitive and or easy access to in the kind of game we'd like to play.

Originally posted by Juan007 And one more thing - about the "not a god hand" hand in the article, this is nothing new really. Swamp + Ritual + Lotus Petal + Rite of Flame + Ad Naus = gg as well, all are unrestricted and that's five cards.

Uh... not if you don't draw into enough mana and/or can't find Tendrils before you hit enough CC that you lose.  Have you played Ad Naus?   Those things happen.  With YawgWin, they don't.